Alternative Engine's (V8) for the Excel

[Pete Boole]

What about a separate tuning/modifications section? I know there are only a few of us who do this, but I think it would still be interesting reading.

Pete

[fueltheburn]

I would join you on a seperate thread that could be broken up into separate areas like engine, gearbox, suspension, cooling etc.
Just waiting confirmation on some mods I.e dyno proven and chassis handling.
I saw a very cool layout on a lotus forum that had a spreadsheet of bhp/£ on a lotus Elise.
It had calculated performance as well if weight was lost, this would equate to a bhp gain.

Until a new thread appears.... I won't touch this one again.

I am just off to get that Oscar produced, nearly forgot that I need to chisel off the writing on it

[257spring]

Ok leave it, it's just I saw Ethels rebuild catching up on replies,
and thought no way!

took the upper half of the head off and the bolt's were really loose
no wonder the oil was leaking over the manifold and there's no gasket
there! Which I thought was odd,

but yeah maybe kill this thread, I'll write a new one if I need some particular info.

But in conclusion it looks like the toyota V8 1uz is the best Conversion.

[mat grant]

Hi all,

I'm not frustrated by this thread - I've found it quite interesting(!) But then I am one of the crazy people doing lots of mods to the car and fitting a different engine. I can second what Pete Boole said regarding the amount of effort needed for an engine swap.

But I can see how the people who have gone to the trouble of offering helpful advice are frustrated by the reluctance of the original poster to accept the advice!

Everyone has different things they want out of a car - for some the heritage and originality is important, some it's handling. For some it's cost. But I think the Lotus excel is the wrong car if you want cheap and reliable. I am reminded of a post on the 1UZ forum I sometimes look at, one guy asking for cheap tuning options. The reply was: there is cheap, fast and reliable - but you can only have two out of the three. I think that applies here.

For me the first priority was reliable (and safe). I've posted before about my decision making, so won't go into it, but in a sentence it was being attached to the car (1979 eclat) and wanting to keep it, but not liking the awful state of it, so getting it to be more to MY liking. I understand and am not offended when people say "that's a rubbish idea".

For mr Spring - I would say heed the advice here - what looks like a cheaper option up front can end up costing more. But good luck with whichever way you go with it.

And I'm all in favour of a crazy ideas section on the forum.

Cheers, Mat.

[257spring]

To many people saying I'm not taking the advice, I'm taking it all in, the problem is I'M SKINT so can't move, when SKINT (hope the spellings ok) you have to wait for opportunities to come up, like there was this strait six supra engine 100k on it, the guy's breaking the car and only wants 50 quid! Now if you can get the gearbox as well, (it's the same gearbox right) your well on the way to getting something rolling there for not much..

Now I've heard that the strait six won't fit and yet I've also heard that it will, which part of that advice should be taken?

I've heard one guy say you can run the car without a thermostat another say's that will cause it to over heat. Which is pretty bad news if you take the first tip and then overheat and blow a gasket say.

I am more interested in strait six toyota as you can buy an old supra for not much and then your getting the everthing you need in the one go.

The last post about the two out of three was really good I thought.

And just a quick word about lotus excels, they are a mixed up car, parts comming from different place's the spirit of the thing is there already, I was talking to a guy about Vercetti motorbike's and he said they made every part themselve's now I guess you'd be right not to modify a Vercetti, but a Lotus! heck it's a race car it's asking for it. I wonder what the people at lotus think about some of this stuff.

But yes there's not a lot of point talking on and on without doing something.
Pete.

[amarshall]

...
I can second what Pete Boole said regarding the amount of effort needed for an engine swap.
...
For mr Spring - I would say heed the advice here - what looks like a cheaper option up front can end up costing more.

IT IS NOT A KIT CAR.

257spring (Mr. Wagstaff), did you ever get your MGB working properly ? Did you import your VW van from Brazil ?

[alanbell]

257spring,
I have been one of your harshest critics in the hope that I could persuade you to stop dreaming. to get your car on the road the cheapest option is to buy an lc runner from lotus bits (£800 self fitted).next rebuild your present engine yourself , provided you have the knowhow, which I doubt. done properly with pistons, liners, con rods, crank reground, new bearings, valves, springs, guides and maybe oil and water pump this will cost about £1200 excluding purchased labour. to fit ANY alterative be it rover v8 Toyota v6,v8 or straight 6 if it will fit, which I doubt, will cost thousands, how many depends on the engine and spec and who does the work.
so here is a plan for you.
1,decide when you want the car on the road
2, decide which engine you want
3, decide what work you REALLY can do yourself on that option
4, realistically price all the parts, labour and fabrication you will need to get the engine into the car and the car with an mot
5.if you cannot reconcile your choice at 1 above with the cash you can pour into the project between now and then choose a cheaper alternative or push 1 further into the future
6 having carried out steps 1 to 5 buy the engine and/or parts and get to work.
7 let us know how you are progressing
good luck
alan

[alanbell]

257spring,
I have been one of your harshest critics in the hope that I could persuade you to stop dreaming. to get your car on the road the cheapest option is to buy an lc runner from lotus bits (£800 self fitted).next rebuild your present engine yourself , provided you have the knowhow, which I doubt. done properly with pistons, liners, con rods, crank reground, new bearings, valves, springs, guides and maybe oil and water pump this will cost about £1200 excluding purchased labour. to fit ANY alterative be it rover v8 Toyota v6,v8 or straight 6 if it will fit, which I doubt, will cost thousands, how many depends on the engine and spec and who does the work.
so here is a plan for you.
1,decide when you want the car on the road
2, decide which engine you want
3, decide what work you REALLY can do yourself on that option
4, realistically price all the parts, labour and fabrication you will need to get the engine into the car and the car with an mot
5.if you cannot reconcile your choice at 1 above with the cash you can pour into the project between now and then choose a cheaper alternative or push 1 further into the future
6 having carried out steps 1 to 5 buy the engine and/or parts and get to work.
7 let us know how you are progressing
good luck
alan

[yroll]

To many people saying I'm not taking the advice, I'm taking it all in, the problem is I'M SKINT so can't move, when SKINT (hope the spellings ok) you have to wait for opportunities to come up, like there was this strait six supra engine 100k on it, the guy's breaking the car and only wants 50 quid! Now if you can get the gearbox as well, (it's the same gearbox right) your well on the way to getting something rolling there for not much..

Now I've heard that the strait six won't fit and yet I've also heard that it will, which part of that advice should be taken?

I've heard one guy say you can run the car without a thermostat another say's that will cause it to over heat. Which is pretty bad news if you take the first tip and then overheat and blow a gasket say.

I am more interested in strait six toyota as you can buy an old supra for not much and then your getting the everthing you need in the one go.

The last post about the two out of three was really good I thought.

And just a quick word about lotus excels, they are a mixed up car, parts comming from different place's the spirit of the thing is there already, I was talking to a guy about Vercetti motorbike's and he said they made every part themselve's now I guess you'd be right not to modify a Vercetti, but a Lotus! heck it's a race car it's asking for it. I wonder what the people at lotus think about some of this stuff.

But yes there's not a lot of point talking on and on without doing something.
Pete.

The cheapest option is to follow this guide
http://www.benani.co.uk/articles/HG/Head_Gasket.html

But if you have driven hard with a faulty headgasket and thermostat you might first check the tolerances on the head and block, i am sure that can't cost much at a mechanic it's like a 30 min job....

So do it and if you want to change engine after you did it, sell the old one. you have all the facts you could possibly need, though if you come across problems or questions that is ok to post and shouldn't get negative answers.

[mat grant]

Mr Marshall - you've quoted me there - but I've missed the bit where I said "it is a kit car" I think you'll find my statements are also applicable to well made cars like Mercedes and Volvos, and hence there is no inference to Lotus being a kit car.

But since you mention it - I am aware that Lotus stopped offering their cars in kit form with the release of the Elite and Eclat, my car (eclat) is hence only one model away from the elan/europa offered as a kit.

But just for clarity: I am not inferring that either the Elite, Eclat or Excel is a kit car. It is a cheap car though, which means people like me will buy them and with no reverence to the brand hack them about to suit their requirements. Mine came with a Lotus chassis that worked and Lotus engine that worked but I chose to fit a different engine and chassis.

Cheers, Mat.

mat grant wrote:
...
I can second what Pete Boole said regarding the amount of effort needed for an engine swap.
...
For mr Spring - I would say heed the advice here - what looks like a cheaper option up front can end up costing more.



IT IS NOT A KIT CAR.

257spring (Mr. Wagstaff), did you ever get your MGB working properly ? Did you import your VW van from Brazil ?


PS - back on topic, I really don't think a toyota straight 6 will fit, I haven't measured one, but did measure a ford duratec 4 cylinder, and that was too tall. Making the assumption the 6 is longer than the ford 4 cylinder, I don't think it will go in without major mods to the front crossmember and or bodywork.

[amarshall]

Mr Marshall - you've quoted me there - but I've missed the bit where I said "it is a kit car" I think you'll find my statements are also applicable to well made cars like Mercedes and Volvos, and hence there is no inference to Lotus being a kit car.

I was quoting your eminently sensible points and then responding to 257spring's comment about the Excel being mixed-up. Sorry for the confusion and any offence.

He seems to think that the Excel is a parts-bin "bitsa" and that, as a result, swapping things around will be easy. Those of us who actually know the cars will know that this is not the case. Yes, it uses parts from elsewhere (as do all cars), but they are engineered into it, not just slapped in any old how.

He pops up in various places with similarly naive (being generous about it) topics.

I can't actually *prove* that he lives under a bridge and eats billy-goats, but my suspicions have been aroused.

[mat grant]

No offence taken

I think mr Alan Bell has hit this on the head though with the most sensible advice..... The cheapest way has to be a good runner second hand 912 (as did Pete Boole a few pages back!).

Cheers, Mat.

[amarshall]

No offence taken

I think mr Alan Bell has hit this on the head though with the most sensible advice..... The cheapest way has to be a good runner second hand 912 (as did Pete Boole a few pages back!).

Cheers, Mat.

I think all of us have said that on at least one of these threads by now.

[alanbell]

pity about the car ;looks like the end of the line for another excel. perhaps we should have permanent advice to first time buyers on this site not as a thread but as an easily available separate and closed heading.
I wonder how much 257spring paid for the car.
ps as for what the people at lotus think of the cars, last weekend at duns ( jim clark weekend) either bob dance or clive chapman, I can't remember which, said " yes,they go on for ever".

[amarshall]

pity about the car ;looks like the end of the line for another excel. perhaps we should have permanent advice to first time buyers on this site not as a thread but as an easily available separate and closed heading.
I wonder how much 257spring paid for the car.

If someone would like to write it (maybe start it as a thread so everyone can contribute), I can edit it and make it a locked sticky at the top of this forum.